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This 11-year-old U.S. citizen has been separated from her asylum-seeking mom for 222 days.

11-year-old Yeisvi Carrillo, an American citizen, has been in foster care for more than 220 days after being forcibly separated from her mother at the border.

Vilma Carrillo and her husband were living in Georgia in 2006 when Vilma gave birth to their daughter, Yeisvi. They lived there for about a year as undocumented farm workers in onion fields and warehouses before returning to their home country of Guatemala to care for Carrillo’s ailing mother in 2007.

A few years later, Carrillo’s husband grew violent. Carrillo was brutally abused, burned and beaten with increasing intensity, to the point that Yeisvi worried that her dad might kill her mom. That’s when Carrillo decided to return to the U.S. with her daughter and seek asylum.


In an interview with Upworthy, Shana Tabak, Executive Director of the Tahirih Justice Center in Atlanta, the legal non-profit who is representing Carrillo in immigration court, describes Carrillo's abuse as "severe." “Her four front teeth were punched out by her abuser,” Tabak says. “She was pulled by her hair, naked, wearing her underwear. Years of this. She finally decided that she feared too much for her life to stay.”

In May, Vilma and Yeisvi crossed the border in Arizona and requested asylum. That’s when they were forcibly separated.

Within 15 minutes of being held, border officials recognized that the 11-year-old Yeisvi was a U.S. citizen. They called in officials from the state of Arizona and told them that they couldn’t detain the girl because of her citizen status.

“They had Vilma sign papers relinquishing her custody of her daughter for 90 days,” says Tabak.  “Vilma did not understand what she was signing because she does not read or write in any language. She’s an indigenous Mam speaker, who at the time spoke very little Spanish and no English.”

Then her daughter was torn from her, Tabak says. “She was crying and screaming so much that Vilma fainted and lost consciousness, and when she woke up her daughter was gone.” Yeisvi was put into foster care and Vilma was transferred to Irwin Detention Center in Atlanta.

It’s now been more than six months since the mother and daughter have seen one another.

In a cruel twist, Carrillo was flown to Texas for reunification in July, when the government was required to reunite separated families. Then she was told, “No, not you.”

As if being separated from your child by half a continent isn’t painful enough, Carrillo briefly thought that she and Yeisvi were going to be reunited when a judge ruled that families who had been subject to the government’s policy of detaining children separately from their parents must be reunited by July 26, 2018.

“In advance of the July deadline the authorities thought that she was qualified for reunification,” says Tabak. “So she and nine of her friends here from the Irwin Detention Center were taken to Texas to be reunited with their daughters. One by one, she watched them all be reunified. She kept asking, 'What about me? What about my daughter?' and they said, 'No, not you,' and then they sent her back here.”

Carrillo went to court without an attorney, without an interpreter who could understand her, and without the asylum documents that had been prepared for her by an attorney. Those documents were in a backpack when she was transferred back to Georgia from Texas, and she wasn’t allowed access to that backpack in time for her hearing. She said, on the record, “I don’t understand what’s happening and I don’t have my documents,” but the judge denied her asylum petition. That denial has been appealed by Tahirih Justice Center lawyers.

Carrillo’s lawyers also submitted a request for humanitarian parole for her so she could be released and reunited with her daughter, says Tabak. But the ICE director in the Atlanta field office refused.

Tabak explains that the federal government has the discretion to release her during the appeals process; they're simply choosing not to.

"Vilma has no criminal history, so she is not subject to mandatory detention. So under the law, Vilma is being held at the discretion of the federal government. That’s why we submitted a request for humanitarian parole. That’s why we applied for bond. Because these are decision points where the federal government, if it were doing its job properly, would evaluate the evidence and make a decision as to whether or not she should stay, and provide an individualized determination of—if they decided to hold her—why they will hold her. But in this case, we are getting no explanation as to why they are holding her. They’re just holding her.”

Carrillo's lawyers have filed a habeas petition challenging the constitutionality of her detention.

Carrillo could be deported and her daughter could be made to stay in the U.S., basically forcing permanent family separation on both an asylum-seeking mother and an American citizen.

Earlier this year, the Trump administration adopted a new policy that says domestic violence generally can’t be used as grounds for asylum, which makes Carrillo’s case harder to appeal. She’s also in Atlanta, Georgia, which Tabak says is the worst place in the United States to be an undocumented immigrant.

“It’s known as an ‘asylum free’ zone,” Tabak says. “Across the country, any immigrant who finds themselves in court and applies for asylum has about a 43% chance of getting asylum. In Atlanta, they have a 2% chance. So this is a terrible place to be applying for asylum.”

Ironically, although the domestic violence Carrillo and her daughter fled from isn't eligible grounds for asylum, that same violence could result in the unthinkable—a permanent separation in which Carrillo could lose custody of her daughter. The courts could potentially decide that it's too unsafe to send Yeisvi—an American citizen—back to Guatemala, meaning she would have to stay in the U.S. in foster care.

There are many possible outcomes to this case. The state of Arizona, where Yeisvi is living, must do what's in the best interest of the child, but there's no way for Yeisvi to legally stay with her mother while she's in detention. As of now, Carrillo is in jeopardy of losing her parental rights completely, solely because ICE is choosing to keep her detained.

Temporary separation following domestic violence and a harrowing journey is traumatic enough. Taking an 11-year-old's mother away from her permanently when she's already been through so much would be outright cruel.

Carrillo's story is gaining national attention and prompting celebrity advocacy.

Penn Badgley, an actor and musician best known for his roles on CW's "Gossip Girl" and the Lifetime-turned-Netflix show "You," has taken an active role in Tahirih Justice Center's advocacy work. He accompanied Tabak on a visit to Carrillo at the Irwin Detention Center on December 14.

"I expressly do not believe that every problem is made better by adding a celebrity," Badgley told Upworthy in an interview. He does, however, believe we all need to use our voices to speak up for justice and to elevate the voices of those who are being harmed by our laws and policies. He says:

“There are a lot of really hard-working and intelligent people who are hitting the books to figure out, okay, where is the legal justification for this treatment of other human beings? They’re seeking asylum. It stands to be repeated, that is not a crime. If anything, they’re victims of crime before they come here. They’re seeking safety. They’re seeking refuge. These are fundamental principles this country is supposed to have been founded on...Our country claims to be a beacon of hope and light and justice in the world, and yet we have many stains on our historical record. These are deep, blood-red stains. If we want to be Americans, which ones do we want to be?"

Badgley says that instead of devolving into talking points, there are some fundamental questions that we as Americans need to be asking ourselves:

"What do these borders mean? What do they mean if they inflict criminal abuse upon people fleeing criminal abuse? If reaching our borders is bringing the same kind of harm or abuse to human beings fleeing abuse, what are we doing? What do these borders mean? What are we trying to protect? If we’re trying to protect our integrity as a nation, we actually might be doing a great job of undermining our integrity."

Badgley has used his social media accounts to help advocate for Vilma Carrillo and her daughter, sharing a petition to tell ICE to release Carrillo and reunite her with Yeisvi.

[rebelmouse-image 19397735 dam="1" original_size="1071x519" caption="Penn Badgley/Instagram" expand=1]Penn Badgley/Instagram

Carrillo's story is unique, but it highlights problematic policies and attitudes toward immigration and asylum.

Tabak says she's seen a shift during her career in immigration and human rights law, which has resulted in some unprecedented actions on behalf of the U.S. government.

“The federal government has been trying to erect a border wall to prevent people from seeking the asylum that they are entitled to under the law,” says Tabak. “Short of getting the permission from Congress to erect a physical wall, the government is doing everything it can to erect a legal wall for clients who are trying to access protection under the law.”

Tabak also points out some of the issues that make the asylum process harder for people like Vilma Carrillo:

“The issues that we’ve seen for a long time in Georgia are the issues that are now relevant across the country. We’re seeing failures of due process, like in Vilma’s case. We’re seeing judges with pronounced and overt bias against our clients. We’re seeing disregard for expert testimony on mental health and trauma. And those are phenomena that have existed in the Atlanta courts for many many years and currently we’re seeing that spread across the country. In addition, I think that some of the choices that the current federal government has taken are simply unprecedented. The choice to separate parents from children as a deterrent, it was contemplated under previous governments, but it was never carried out. That simply is unprecedented. It is in clear violation of international law."

Advocates for Carrillo hope to get a hearing to reunite Vilma and Yeisvi by Yeisvi's 12th birthday on December 20. Here are ways everyone can help:

Join those calling for Vilma and Yeisvi's reunification by signing and sharing this Change.org petition. Make a donation to support the work of Tahirih Justice Center or other non-profits that help represent immigrant families in court. And finally, use your civic voice to remind the U.S. government that asylum is a legal human right and that #familiesbelongtogether.

via Meg Sullivan (used with permission) and Canva/Photos

A volunteer hands out food in a food bank and Meg Sullivan shares her dad's kind gesture.

When we consider people who have had a positive impact on the world, we often think of those who have made grand gestures to improve the lives of others, such as Martin Luther King, Jr., Greta Thunberg, or Mahatma Gandhi. Unfortunately, that type of effort is out of reach for the average person.

However, O Organics would like to remind everyone that they can positively impact the world through small, consistent acts of kindness that add up over time. Much like how a small creek can create a valley over the years, we can change lives through small, consistent acts of kindness.

O Organics is dedicated to the well-being of all by nourishing people everywhere with delicious organic foods grown by producers who meet USDA-certified organic farming standards.

Upworthy's Instagram page recently posted a touching example of everyday kindness. Meg Sullivan shared how her father, Tom, peeled oranges for her lunch just about every day from kindergarten through high school. But on the final day of her senior year of high school, he sent his 17-year-old daughter unpeeled oranges with a touching note about how she’d have to start peeling them for herself.



“It’s Time Baby Girl,” he wrote on a wikiHow printout on how to peel an orange with a drawing of himself crying. For the father, this daily ritual was about more than just making lunch; it was about showing that he cared by going the extra mile. “I could have put money on her lunch account,” Tom told Today.com. “But it’s one of those little things I thought was important, that she knows somebody’s taking the time to take care of her.”

The small, daily gesture taught Megan an essential lesson in kindness.

The post reminded people how their fathers’ small acts of kindness meant so much to them. “My dad peeled my oranges until I graduated high school, too. Now, I peel my daughter’s oranges and will for the next 7 plus years,” Katie wrote in the comments. “Love this. My dad peeled mine, too. When I moved out, he gave me an orange peeler gadget,” Mary added.

o organics, albertson's giving backO Organics has a wide array of foods and flavors covering almost everything on your shopping list.via Albertson's

Did you know that every time you go to the supermarket, you can also change the world through small gestures? O Organics not only allows you to feed your family delicious and nutritious organic food, but each purchase also gives back to help people and communities facing food insecurity.

Through contributions from customers like you, O Organics donates up to 28 million meals annually. The company’s contribution is essential when, according to the USDA, 47.4 million Americans live in food-insecure households.

O Organics has a wide array of foods and flavors covering almost everything on your shopping list. “Over the years, we have made organic foods more accessible by expanding O Organics to every aisle across our stores, making it possible for health and budget-conscious families to incorporate organic food into every meal,” Jennifer Saenz, EVP and Chief Merchandising Officer at Albertsons, one of many stores where you can find O Organics products, said in a statement.

O Organics now offers over 1500 items, from dairy products such as eggs and milk to packaged meats and breakfast staples such as cereal bars, granola and oatmeal. You can also enjoy affordable organic produce with O Organics’ fresh salads and fruit.

Everybody wants to make the world a better place. With O Organics, you can feed your family healthy, organic food every time you go to the market while paying it forward by contributing to the company’s efforts to end food insecurity nationwide. That’s a small, daily gesture that can amount to incredible change.

via Canva

A doctor is analyzing brain scans.

Death remains one of the greatest mysteries of life. It’s impossible to know what happens as a person passes and whether there’s anything afterward because no one has ever been able to report what happens from beyond the grave. Of course, if you ask those with a keen interest in the supernatural, they may say otherwise.

However, in 2021, researcher Dr. Raul Vicente and his colleagues at the University of Tartu, Estonia, became the first people ever to record the brainwaves of someone in the process of dying, and what they’ve come to realize should be very comforting to everyone. “We measured 900 seconds of brain activity around the time of death and set a specific focus to investigate what happened in the 30 seconds before and after the heart stopped beating,” Dr. Ajmal Zemmar, a neurosurgeon at the University of Louisville, US, who organized the study, told Frontiers.


The patient who died while having his brain waves measured was 87 years old and had epilepsy. While researchers were studying his brain to learn more about the condition, they had a heart attack and passed away. “Just before and after the heart stopped working, we saw changes in a specific band of neural oscillations, so-called gamma oscillations, but also in others such as delta, theta, alpha, and beta oscillations,” Zemmar said.

The different types of brain oscillations that occurred in the patient before and after the heart attack were associated with high cognitive functions, including dreaming, concentrating, memory retrieval, and memory flashbacks. Therefore, it’s possible that as the patient was dying, they had their life flash before their eyes. What an amazing and comforting experience right before leaving this mortal coil.

“Through generating oscillations involved in memory retrieval, the brain may be playing a last recall of important life events just before we die, similar to the ones reported in near-death experiences,” Zemmar speculated. “These findings challenge our understanding of when exactly life ends and generate important subsequent questions, such as those related to the timing of organ donation.”


How long are people conscious after they are technically dead?

Science has found that people can remain conscious up to 20 seconds after they are declared dead. Even after the heart and breathing have stopped, the cerebral cortex can hang on for a while without oxygen. So, some people may experience the moment when they hear themselves declared dead, but they aren’t able to move or react to the news. In cases where someone performs CPR on the deceased person, the blood pumped by the compressions can temporarily keep the brain alive as well.

Although the experience of death will probably always remain a mystery, we should take solace in the idea that, in many cases, it may not necessarily be a miserable experience but an ecstatic final burst of consciousness that welcomes us into the great beyond. “Something we may learn from this research is: although our loved ones have their eyes closed and are ready to leave us to rest, their brains may be replaying some of the nicest moments they experienced in their lives,” Zemmar concludes.

Humor

Women are sharing quirky things they do to make life more whimsical and it's pure delight

"I kiss my cat on both cheeks then she kisses me on both cheeks then I explain 'she's European' to no one."

We all could use a little whimsy in our lives.

One of the funniest things about being human is the unique quirks each one of us has that other people don't know about. In some sense, our individual oddities are things that unite us even though they are hidden from public view. It's a simple, universal truth that we're all a bit silly in our own way.

Case in point: A trend in which women share the quirky little things they do to make life more whimsical. The conversation has been circulating on social media since someone asked, "Girlies: What are some things you do to be more whimsical? I love knowing about cute little habits." And the responses, "like a magical, much-needed hug," are filling people with joy.

The question asked for women to weigh in, but there's no indication that men don't also have funny private habits as well, so we can all see ourselves in these responses.

Check out this list of people's quirky whimsical habits

"I wear matching pajamas every time I change my sheets so I can have what I call fancy sleep."

"I hold 'office hours' every Tuesday at a local coffee shop, which means I sit on the couch and order drinks for 4-5 hours while various friends and acquaintances visit me to yap abt books and gossip."

"I say, 'my lady,' every time I walk by a mirror."

"I teach the dog how to do things either to make them more interesting for me ('Let me show you how to start a load of laundry') or just to make him feel included ('Do you remember how to make coffee or should I walk you through it again? I know it's hard to remember since you can't practice without thumbs.')"

"I kiss my cat on both cheeks then she kisses me on both cheeks then I explain 'she's European' to no one."

"I tell my dishes it's bath time."

"I sleep in vintage nightgowns, it makes me feel like an 1800s princess✨"

"If I want to have negative thoughts about myself I have to think them in a cockney accent."


@abigail.bailey0

i’ve been home sick d: #whimsical #alternative #weird #tips #trinkets #habits #odd #corecore

"I say, 'May I take your coats?' when I'm peeling garlic."

"Every time I see the moon, I shout 'Hey gurrrl! Looking amazing, you are glowing!' and just compliment the hell out of her because she’s my bestie."

"I like drinking water at night ouf of small wooden bowls. It makes me feel like I'm being nursed back to health by spirits."

"I shout 'NO, not YOU! I don’t even know you!' in the voice of Lilly Moscocvitz when I’m looking for something and find something else unrelated."

"I hot glued a bow tie onto the Roomba and we call him Jeffrey."

"I tell my hamster not to answer the door for anyone before I leave."

"I call putting on pj's 'time to pump up the jams.'"

Giphy

"I always set my alarm clock to weird times like 8:52 am or 4:47pm because I don’t want less used numbers to be lonely or sad."

"Sometimes, a couple hours before bed, I go in my room and turn down the bed, spray a bit of lavender, maybe light a candle, put my water with lemon on my bedside table. Then when I get ready to go to bed a couple hours later I walk in and say 'I love turndown service!' as though it’s a pleasant surprise."

"Any time I make a mistake at work I giggle to myself, apologize, and say 'it’s my first day.' I’ve worked for the same company for 5 and a half years."

"I call my to do list my TA DA list and do jazz hands as I tick things off."

"For my own amusement I say 'officers!' and nod when I see pigeons."

"This one is kinda niche, but I’m a hairstylist. Whenever I wash my clients hair, as I give them a head massage with the conditioner I send loving thoughts into the universe over whatever is going on in their life."

"Whenever I buy something online and it asks 'is this a gift?' I write a little gift message to myself, usually along the lines of 'you are awesome and deserve these little treats.'"


Treat Yourself Donna Meagle GIF by Parks and RecreationGiphy

There are soooo many more, and each one is more delightful than the last. Turns out a whole bunch of us are a whole lot goofier in our private lives than we let on, which is a wonderful discovery.

Can whimsy actually be useful?

But there's more to this trend than simply a love of whimsy. As one commenter pointed out, "There are literal therapeutic reframing techniques in here that are FANTASTIC." It's true. Making a boring or mundane task more fun or interesting can be helpful for people who are prone to procrastination. Changing the voice you use when negative thoughts creep in can help distance that voice from your inner self. Pampering yourself by making bedtime special can create positive associations with rest and sleep, making it easier for you to settle in at night.

Perhaps our penchant for fun and whimsy isn't as frivolous as it might first appear, so if you do things like this, give yourself a pat on the back for engaging in good self-care. And now you know for sure that you're definitely not alone.


Unsplash

When talking with other parents I know, it's hard not to sound like a grumpy old man when we get around to discussing school schedules. "Am I the only one who feels like kids have so many days off? I never got that many days off when I was a kid! And I had to go work in the coal mine after, too!" I know what I sound like, but I just can't help it.

In Georgia, where I live, we have a shorter summer break than some other parts of the country. But my kids have the entire week of Thanksgiving off, a week in September, two whole weeks at Christmas, a whole week off in February, and a weeklong spring break. They have asynchronous days (during which they complete assignments at home, which usually takes about 30 minutes) about once a month, and they have two or three half-day weeks throughout the year. Quite honestly, it feels like they're never in school for very long before they get another break, which makes it tough to get in a rhythm with work and career goals. Plus, we're constantly arranging day camps and other childcare options for all the time off. Actually, I just looked it up and I'm not losing my mind: American kids have fewer school days than most other major countries.

So it caught my attention in a major way when I read that Whitney Independent School District in Texas recently decided to enact a 4-day week heading into the 2025 school year. That makes it one of dozens of school districts in Texas to make the change and over 900 nationally.


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The thought of having the kids home from school EVERY Friday or Monday makes me want to break out in stress hives. But this 4-day school week movement isn't designed to give parents a headache. It's meant to lure teachers back to work.

Yes, teachers are leaving the profession in droves and young graduates don't seem eager to replace them. Why? The pay is bad, for starters, but that's just the beginning. Teachers are burnt out, undermined and criticized relentlessly, held hostage by standardized testing, and more. It can be a grueling, demoralizing, and thankless job. The love and passion they have for shaping the youth of tomorrow can only take you so far when you feel like you're constantly getting the short end of the stick.

School districts want to pay their teachers more, in theory, but their hands are often tied. So they're getting creative to recruit the next generation of teachers into their schools — starting with an extra day off for planning, catch-up, or family time every week.

Teachers in 4-day districts often love the new schedule. Kids love it (obviously). It's the parents who, as a whole, aren't super thrilled.

Photo by National Cancer Institute on Unsplash

So far, the data shows that the truncated schedule perk is working. In these districts, job applications for teachers are up, retirements are down, and teachers are reporting better mental well-being. That's great news!

But these positive developments may be coming at the price of the working parents in the communities. Most early adopters of the 4-day week have been rural communities with a high prevalence of stay-at-home parents. As the idea starts to take hold in other parts of the country, it's getting more pushback. Discussions on Reddit, Facebook, and other social media are overrun with debate on how this is all going to shake up. Some parents, to be fair, like the idea! If they stay-at-home or have a lot of flexibility, they see it as an opportunity for more family time. But many are feeling anxious. Here's what's got those parents worried:

The effect on students' achievement is still unclear.

The execution of the 4-day week varies from district to district. Some schools extend the length of each of the four days, making the total instructional time the same. That makes for a really long day, and some teachers say the students are tired and more unruly by the late afternoon. Some districts are just going with less instruction time overall, which has parents concerned that their kids might fall behind.

4-day school weeks put parents in a childcare bind.

Having two working parents is becoming more common and necessary with the high cost of living. I know, I know — "school isn't daycare!" But it is the safe, reliable, and educational place we send our kids while we need to work.

Families with money and resources may be able to enroll their kids in more academics, extracurriculars, sports, or childcare, but a lot of normal families won't be able to afford that cost. Some schools running a 4-day week offer a paid childcare option for the day off, but that's an added expense and for families with multiple kids in the school system, it's just not possible.

This will inevitably end with some kids getting way more screentime.

With most parents still working 5-day weeks, and the cost of extra activities or childcare too high, a lot of kids are going to end up sitting around on the couch with their iPad on those days off. I'm no expert, and I'm certainly not against screentime, but adding another several hours of it to a child's week seems less than ideal.

Of course there are other options other than paid childcare and iPads. There are play dates, there's getting help from family and friends. All of these options are an enormous amount of work to arrange for parents who are already at capacity.

Working 4 days is definitely a win for teachers that makes the job more appealing. But it doesn't address the systemic issues that are driving them to quit, retire early, or give up their dreams of teaching all together.

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A Commissioner of Education from Missouri calls truncated schedules a "band-aid solution with diminishing returns." Having an extra planning day won't stop teachers from getting scapegoated by politicians or held to impossible curriculum standards, it won't keep them from having to buy their own supplies or deal with ever-worsening student behavior.

Some teachers and other experts have suggested having a modified 5-day school week, where one of the days gets set aside as a teacher planning day while students are still on-site participating in clubs, music, art — you know, all the stuff that's been getting cut in recent years. Something like that could work in some places.

As a dad, I don't mind the idea of my busy kids having an extra day off to unwind, pursue hobbies, see friends, catch up on projects, or spend time as a family. And I'm also very much in favor of anything that takes pressure off of overworked teachers. But until we adopt a 4-day work week as the standard, the 4-day school week is always going to feel a little out of place.


Celebrity

In 2006, the Oscars secretly pressured Heath Ledger to make fun of gay people. He wasn't having it.

Jake Gyllenhaal shared the story of his late Brokeback Mountain co-star's kindness.

Fájl:Heath Ledger.jpg – Wikipédia

Heath Ledger stayed true to his convictions. He stood up for what he believed in, and it didn't matter if it was in a casual conversation with a friend, on a press junket, or at the Oscars. In a resurfaced video making the rounds, Heath was on the Brokeback Mountain press tour and was asked by an interviewer, "How do you respond to people who suggest this is disgusting?"

Heath seems initially taken aback by the question. He ponders for a moment and then says, "Well, I think it's immature, for one. I think it's an incredible shame that people go out of their way to voice their disgust or negative opinions about the way two people wish to love one another."

- YouTubewww.youtube.com


He then expresses how some might be focusing on the wrong things. "At least voice your opinions on how two people share hate and violence and anger towards each other. Isn't that more important? I think so."

Brokeback Mountain is a 2005 film starring Ledger alongside Jake Gyllenhaal, about two sheep herders in Wyoming who find love with one another. It was adapted from a short story by Annie Proulx, originally published in The New Yorker in 1997.

mountain GIFGiphy

In discussing the movie itself (which won three Academy Awards in 2006, including Best Director for Ang Lee, Best Adapted Screenplay, and Best Original Score), Heath explained, "It's obviously about two men in love. It's gay-themed and easily labeled. The pure fact of it is, it transcends labels. It's the story of two human beings—two souls who are in love."

He truly wanted to make sure that audiences (including the press) understood the entire point of the film. "We're showing that love between two men is just as infectious and emotional and strong and pure as it is with heterosexual love."

While this clip has popped up many times over the years, an interview with Jake Gyllenhaal in 2020 definitively confirmed how important these themes were to Heath. In an interview with Another Man magazine, he discusses how the whole production came together. “There are things you’re chosen for—a quality, an essence—and Ang did that. And it’s still a mystery to me. And something that Heath and I shared: that it was a mystery to us at the time.”

Jake emphasized that Heath put his foot down when some writers of the Oscars telecast wanted to make light of Brokeback Mountain. "I mean, I remember they wanted to do an opening for the Academy Awards that year that was sort of joking about it. And Heath refused. I was sort of at the time, 'Oh, okay... Whatever.' I'm always like, 'It's all in good fun.' And Heath said, 'It's not a joke to me. I don't want to make any jokes about it.'"

According to WION News, Jake reminisced, "That's the thing I loved about Heath. He would never joke. Someone wanted to make a joke about the story or whatever, he was like, 'No. This is about love. Like, that's it, man.'"

via Canva

A man and woman having a conversation.

Small talk can feel awkward, especially when talking to someone you don’t know very well and run out of things to say. That awkward silence may only last a few seconds but can feel like an eternity. Small talk can be uncomfortable, but it’s the gateway to starting relationships, creating professional opportunities, and building self-confidence. Becoming a master of small talk opens up possibilities, but how do you improve your skills?

One way to elevate your small talk game is by using a technique known as conversational threading. Adding a few more details to your questions and responses can open up different avenues to take the conversation and prevent it from stalling after a question or two. The key is to be an active listener with intentional questions.

How to get better at small talk

“The problem with most small talk is that it’s happening on autopilot, which means that people are asking questions they can already predict the answers to, such as: ‘How are you?’ ‘How’s the weather?’ “How was your weekend?’” Lorraine Lee, an award-winning virtual keynote speaker and CEO of RISE Learning Solutions, told CNBC Make It. The problem is that when you ask autopilot questions, you’re bound to get predictable answers, making it hard for the conversation to get off the ground.

Question: “How are you doing?”

Predictable answer: “Fine, how are you?”

Good answer: “Great, I’m planning a trip to Mexico, and I’ve really been enjoying ‘The White Lotus’ on Max."


The “good answer” here gives the person you’re talking to two threads to follow. They can ask you about Mexico or share how they once went to Cancun and had a great time. They can also reply to your thread about “The White Lotus” and discuss whether they have seen it.

Question: “Cold outside, isn’t it?”

Predictable answer: “Yeah, I’m freezing.”

Good answer: “It reminds me of the blizzard we had a few years back. What year was that?”

The “good answer” here also gives the person you’re talking to two threads. They can speculate on the date of the blizzard or share their experience with the snowstorm. The “predictable answer” stops the conversation in its tracks.

What are subject words?

Sean Cooper, known as the “shyness and social anxiety guy,” says we should look for “subject words” when talking with people because those will provide potential threads for a more meaningful conversation. For example: “I bought tires at the Goodyear station with my wife on Saturday” has four different keywords: tires, Goodyear, wife, and Saturday.” If you’re listening, it gives you four ways to turn the conversation into something more:

Tires — “Gee, I can’t remember the last time I changed my tires…”

Goodyear — “Is that the tire store off of Crenshaw Boulevard? Do they have good service?”

Wife — “How is your wife doing these days?”

Saturday — “Saturday was a lot of fun, I took my daughter to a horse stable."

Also, you can create better threads by asking more specific questions.

Autopilot question: “Do you come here often?”

Good question: “What’s your favorite drink at this bar?”

Autopilot question: “How are you doing?”

Good question: “What’s been the highlight of the week?”

Becoming good at small talk isn’t difficult as long as you can turn off autopilot and become more intentional with your questions and answers. Be sure to load up your responses with plenty of threads and keywords so that you’re partner can choose a direction for the conversation. As long as you keep threading the conversation, your relationship has room to grow and flourish.